<\/p>\n
<\/iframe><\/p>\n<p><iframe data-testid=\"embed-iframe\" style=\"border-radius:12px\" src=\"https:\/\/open.spotify.com\/embed\/episode\/4hUqoXyciifwnEs7j7mVjW\/video?utm_source=generator\" width=\"100%\" height=\"400\" frameborder=\"0\" allowfullscreen=\"\" allow=\"autoplay; clipboard-write; encrypted-media; fullscreen; picture-in-picture\" loading=\"lazy\"><\/iframe><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 300;\">Two couples take the stage with a shared question\u2014but very different financial realities: <\/span><i><span style=\"font-weight: 300;\">When is \u201cenough\u201d actually enough to move forward?<\/span><\/i><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 300;\">Finn and Luna built a successful pet-sitting business and now sit on hundreds of thousands of dollars\u2014but with no clear plan for investing, homeownership, or the future. Meanwhile, Monica and Antonio earn a strong income, are completely debt-free, and yet feel paralyzed by fear as they juggle parenting, aging parents, and the possibility of purchasing a larger home.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 300;\">In this live episode, Ramit digs into the tension between optimism and realism, abundance and anxiety. Together, they confront inherited money stories, decision paralysis, and what it really takes to turn income into confidence\u2014so money stops being the thing that holds them back.<\/span><\/p>\n<h4><b>In this episode we uncover:<\/b><\/h4>\n<ul>\n<li style=\"font-weight: 300;\" aria-level=\"1\"><span style=\"font-weight: 300;\">Why having \u201chundreds of thousands of dollars\u201d can still feel like total financial chaos without a system<\/span><\/li>\n<li style=\"font-weight: 300;\" aria-level=\"1\"><span style=\"font-weight: 300;\">The emotional whiplash of going from paycheck-to-paycheck to sudden abundance<\/span><\/li>\n<li style=\"font-weight: 300;\" aria-level=\"1\"><span style=\"font-weight: 300;\">How Finn and Luna\u2019s optimism vs. realism split shows up in every conversation about housing, investing, and location<\/span><\/li>\n<li style=\"font-weight: 300;\" aria-level=\"1\"><span style=\"font-weight: 300;\">Why crypto success without understanding risk creates false confidence<\/span><\/li>\n<li style=\"font-weight: 300;\" aria-level=\"1\"><span style=\"font-weight: 300;\">The real reason Luna pulled money out of investments and parked it in cash<\/span><\/li>\n<li style=\"font-weight: 300;\" aria-level=\"1\"><span style=\"font-weight: 300;\">How not knowing basic investing terms keeps progress stalled<\/span><\/li>\n<li style=\"font-weight: 300;\" aria-level=\"1\"><span style=\"font-weight: 300;\">Finn\u2019s fear that California homeownership is a ticking time bomb<\/span><\/li>\n<li style=\"font-weight: 300;\" aria-level=\"1\"><span style=\"font-weight: 300;\">Monica and Antonio\u2019s decision paralysis despite high income and zero debt<\/span><\/li>\n<li style=\"font-weight: 300;\" aria-level=\"1\"><span style=\"font-weight: 300;\">How generational trauma, bankruptcies, and lost homes shaped Monica\u2019s daily money anxiety<\/span><\/li>\n<li style=\"font-weight: 300;\" aria-level=\"1\"><span style=\"font-weight: 300;\">Why Antonio believes earning more is the solution<\/span><\/li>\n<li style=\"font-weight: 300;\" aria-level=\"1\"><span style=\"font-weight: 300;\">The financial and emotional toll of supporting aging parents while raising young children<\/span><\/li>\n<li style=\"font-weight: 300;\" aria-level=\"1\"><span style=\"font-weight: 300;\">The hidden cost of being \u201cresponsible for everyone\u201d and never prioritizing your own future<\/span><\/li>\n<li style=\"font-weight: 300;\" aria-level=\"1\"><span style=\"font-weight: 300;\">The shift from reacting emotionally to money toward making deliberate, shared financial decisions<\/span><\/li>\n<li style=\"font-weight: 300;\" aria-level=\"1\"><span style=\"font-weight: 300;\">What changes when money stops being mysterious<\/span><\/li>\n<\/ul>\n<h4><b>Chapters:<\/b><\/h4>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 300;\">(00:00:00) <\/span><span style=\"font-weight: 300;\">\u201cI\u2019m a dreamer\u201d\u2014and he just wants a real plan<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 300;\">(00:25:32)<\/span> <span style=\"font-weight: 300;\">What happens when the optimizer stops optimizing at home?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 300;\">(00:33:01)<\/span> <span style=\"font-weight: 300;\">\u201cThey gave up everything for us\u201d<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 300;\">(00:46:33)<\/span> <span style=\"font-weight: 300;\">\u201cWe make great money\u2014but it doesn\u2019t feel like enough\u201d<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 300;\">(00:57:52)<\/span> <span style=\"font-weight: 300;\">\u201cI set the bar so high I can never win\u201d<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 300;\">(01:04:37)<\/span> <span style=\"font-weight: 300;\">Where are they now? Both couples\u2019 follow-ups<\/span><\/p>\n<h4><b>This episode is brought to you by:<\/b><\/h4>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 300;\">Bilt | Join the loyalty program for renters at <\/span><strong><a href=\"https:\/\/joinbilt.com\/ramit\">https:\/\/joinbilt.com\/ramit<\/a><\/strong><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 300;\">Shopify | Sign up for a $1 per month trial period at <\/span><strong><a href=\"https:\/\/shopify.com\/ramit\">https:\/\/shopify.com\/ramit<\/a><\/strong><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 300;\">Fabric by Gerber Life | Join the thousands of parents who trust Fabric to protect their family. Apply today in just minutes at <\/span><strong><a href=\"https:\/\/meetfabric.com\/ramit\">https:\/\/meetfabric.com\/ramit<\/a><\/strong><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 300;\">Gelt | Book a tax consultation with Gelt at <\/span><strong><a href=\"https:\/\/joingelt.com\/ramit\">https:\/\/joingelt.com\/ramit<\/a><\/strong><span style=\"font-weight: 300;\">. As a member of my community, you can skip the waitlist<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 300;\">LMNT | Get a free 8-count Sample Pack with any LMNT order at <\/span><strong><a href=\"https:\/\/drinklmnt.com\/RAMIT\">https:\/\/drinklmnt.com\/RAMIT<\/a><\/strong><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 300;\">Masterclass | Get up to 50% off Masterclass during the holiday season at <\/span><strong><a href=\"https:\/\/masterclass.com\/ramit\">https:\/\/masterclass.com\/ramit<\/a><\/strong><\/p>\n<h4><b>Links Mentioned In This Episode:<\/b><\/h4>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 300;\">If you want help with your finances, join my Money Coaching program at <\/span><strong><a href=\"https:\/\/iwt.com\/moneycoaching\">https:\/\/iwt.com\/moneycoaching<\/a><\/strong><\/p>\n<h2 aria-level=\"2\"><b><span data-contrast=\"none\">Transcript<\/span><\/b><span data-ccp-props=\"{"134233117":false,"134233118":false,"134245418":true,"134245529":true,"201341983":0,"335559685":2010,"335559737":2010,"335559738":375,"335559739":375,"335559740":768}\">\u00a0<\/span><\/h2>\n<p><a href=\"https:\/\/drive.google.com\/file\/d\/1OGKrJzsNY71RSr0D5wJqgIf6WfJtMvH8\/view?usp=sharing\"><span data-contrast=\"none\">Download the full transcript PDF<\/span><\/a><span data-ccp-props=\"{"134233117":false,"134233118":false,"335559685":2010,"335559737":2010,"335559738":150,"335559739":150}\">\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:00:00]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0I understand you all have $2,000 in psychedelic stocks. What the\u00a0[Bleep]\u00a0is that?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:00:06]\u00a0<\/span><b>Finn:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0We took a couple thousand dollars from our wedding gifts, and we bought mushroom stocks. You’ve never been on shroom stocks on Reddit?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:00:14]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0No, I have not. I have not stumbled across that sub-Reddit.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:00:17]\u00a0<\/span><b>Finn:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0I understand that we need to have an actual plan, but we’re unsophisticated with money.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:00:24]\u00a0<\/span><b>Luna:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0If I have the money, for example, in my checking account, then get spent until it gets replenished.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:00:30]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Wow. Y’all agree you have a high income?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:00:33]\u00a0<\/span><b>Antonio:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0We don’t feel like it.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:00:34]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0No. we don’t feel like it.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:00:35]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0That’s a high income. And don’t pull that\u00a0[Bleep]\u00a0on me. Not in San Francisco. Come on.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:00:41]\u00a0<\/span><b>Antonio:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0I’m more self-aware, she’s more critical of herself with just the behavior and the responsibility that she has and has been instilled with her.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:00:49]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Let me ask you, Monica. Do you recognize that?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:00:52]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0I hear you.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:00:53]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Mm-hmm.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:00:54]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0But the honest answer is no.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:00:58]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0You can’t go the next 30 years feeling horrible. You just can’t. No one can run a marathon that long and hate what they’re doing.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[Narration]<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:01:05]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0You ever feel like no matter how much money you earn, it doesn’t feel like it’s enough?\u00a0I recently did a live\u00a0Money for\u00a0Couples book tour and today you’re\u00a0going to\u00a0meet two couples in San Francisco, who I promise will surprise you. One of them makes over $230,000 a year, but they still feel like they are barely keeping up.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:01:25]\u00a0The other, let’s just say that their investment choices actually left me speechless. Different incomes, different goals, completely different philosophies, but both of them are asking the same thing. How do we build a future together,\u00a0and why does this feel so hard?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:01:44]\u00a0We’re\u00a0going to\u00a0start with Finn and Luna.\u00a0They’re at the very beginning of their financial journey. They want to educate themselves. And I have to tell you, they have some very peculiar choices that they have made about money.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:01:55]\u00a0I’m looking at their conscious spending plan, and if you want my help with your CSP, especially as we start a new year,\u00a0I want you to check out my money coaching program.\u00a0It is the greatest gift you can give yourself to live a\u00a0Rich Life\u00a0in 2026. You can join at iwt.com\/moneycoaching.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:02:14]\u00a0Their assets,\u00a0$20,000.\u00a0Investments, 240,000.\u00a0Savings, 60,000.\u00a0Debt,\u00a0zero. Great job. Total net worth,\u00a0$320,000. And together they earn nearly $100,000 a year. Their fixed costs are at 67%, a little higher than I like to see. Investments are at zero for monthly contributions. You’re\u00a0going to\u00a0hear Luna give a very interesting explanation in just a minute for that. Savings are at zero. I’m curious about that. Guilt-free spending is at 33%. That’s especially high for a couple that doesn’t really put money towards savings or investments.\u00a0So obviously I have a lot of questions. What do you say we get into it?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[Interview]<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:02:52]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0So I\u00a0need your help to welcome our first couple.\u00a0Please get on your feet and welcome Finn and Luna.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[Applause]<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:03:02]\u00a0Welcome, welcome, welcome. How you doing? All right. Hello. Have a seat. Thank you. How’s it going?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:03:14]\u00a0<\/span><b>Luna:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Great.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:03:15]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0How you feeling?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:03:15]\u00a0<\/span><b>Finn:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Nervous.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:03:17]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Nervous. Okay.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:03:18]\u00a0<\/span><b>Finn:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0I feel sick to my stomach.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:03:22]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Can we give it up for Finn and Luna please? [Applause] So Finn, you wrote in your application that since you both gave up your careers as caregivers and started your own business, “We have basically disagreed about how we spend and where we should live and plan to buy a home every step of the way.” Is that true?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:03:51]\u00a0<\/span><b>Finn:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0I would say that there is a lot of agreement with our spending. There was much more disagreement in the past.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:04:00]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Okay. Let’s go back to a specific disagreement that the two of you had. What would it be about? House?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:04:08]\u00a0<\/span><b>Finn:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0In the beginning, she says cherry juice, which is a good example. She is an organic eater and drinker. We drink organic cherry juice every night.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:04:22]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Okay. What is happening right now? I just want to know a disagreement. You guys can’t tell me you disagree about cherry juice. Is this really happening?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:04:30]\u00a0<\/span><b>Finn:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Organics foods.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:04:32]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Okay. Luna?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:04:36]\u00a0<\/span><b>Luna:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Yeah. So it used be more so he was against spending that extra money for organic food over the years. I have convinced him of the benefit of it. Cherry juice was a big contentious one just because–<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:04:51]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0How much does cherry juice cost? I’m out of the market.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:04:54]\u00a0<\/span><b>Finn:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0It’s expensive. It could be 7, $8 a bottle.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:04:57]\u00a0<\/span><b>Luna:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Whereas non-organic cherry juice is like two bucks.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:05:01]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Okay. This is a big disagreement.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:05:03]\u00a0<\/span><b>Luna:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0It’s not huge. Not anymore.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:05:04]\u00a0<\/span><b>Finn:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0I’m a very frugal person, so I’m looking for the cheaper way to do things.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:05:10]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Mm-hmm. Maybe I can ask another question. Was there a van that either of you was going to purchase? Oh, let’s hear about that. Luna?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:05:20]\u00a0<\/span><b>Luna:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0So basically I had a windfall. My grandmother started an investment account for me and eventually, I got it. And it was enough to buy a van and convert it or buy a converted van.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:05:38]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Can we talk real numbers? How much did you get?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:05:41]\u00a0<\/span><b>Luna:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0I got about $200,000, and part of it was in cash and part of it was in stocks.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:05:48]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0So 200k, and you wanted to buy a van.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:05:50]\u00a0<\/span><b>Luna:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0With the cash portion?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:05:52]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Okay. How much was the van?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:05:54]\u00a0<\/span><b>Luna:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0A legit one, the one that I wanted probably would’ve been 80k, totally converted.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:06:01]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0How the [Bleep] were we just talking about cherry juice where there’s an 80k van on the table? What is happening right now? Okay, 80k. What brand van?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:06:12]\u00a0<\/span><b>Luna:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0A Sprinter.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:06:14]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Okay. And so did you get it?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:06:17]\u00a0<\/span><b>Luna:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0No.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:06:17]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0How come?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:06:19]\u00a0<\/span><b>Luna:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0He pretty much convinced me that it would not be a financially sound investment, that it would lose its value pretty instantaneously.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:06:27]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Hold on. A car is never an investment, except in rare cases.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:06:32]\u00a0<\/span><b>Luna:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0I thought we could live out of it and we could travel, so we wouldn’t have to pay rent.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:06:38]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Okay. I guess that’s true.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:06:40]\u00a0<\/span><b>Luna:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0And so in the long run, I did super rough math and I was like, “If we don’t pay rent for a couple of years and we live out of this van, then it basically pays for itself.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:06:51]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Pays for itself.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:06:57]\u00a0<\/span><b>Luna:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0And then I have a van.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:06:58]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0I tried that too with a cashmere coat. I tried to say that with my wife. She didn’t buy it. It pays for itself. So you had a 80k van out of 200k.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:07:10]\u00a0<\/span><b>Finn:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Right.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:07:11]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0That seems like a lot, like out of a 200k, let’s call it inheritance, to spend almost half of it on a van. What do you think about that?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:07:20]\u00a0<\/span><b>Luna:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0It sounded a really good idea to me. We were working 100 hours a week, and while our living situation was paid for through that 100 hours of work a week, it was feeling like a lot, and I was ready to just call it quits and live in a van.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:07:40]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Okay.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:07:41]\u00a0<\/span><b>Luna:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0So it sounded good.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:07:41]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Finn, you said it won’t be a good investment, which I, agree with.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:07:45]\u00a0<\/span><b>Luna:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Right.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:07:45]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0All right. So what’s with the 200k now?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:07:52]\u00a0<\/span><b>Luna:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0The majority of it is still in stocks, and we did buy a car with it.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:07:59]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0You did?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:07:59]\u00a0<\/span><b>Luna:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Mm-hmm.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:08:00]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0What kind of car?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:08:03]\u00a0<\/span><b>Finn:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0It’s my dream car. You don’t like Fords, but it’s a Ford Escape.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:08:07]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0You bought a Ford?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:08:08]\u00a0<\/span><b>Luna:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Ford Escape hybrid.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:08:09]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Your dream car’s a Ford?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:08:10]\u00a0<\/span><b>Finn:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0It currently is.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:08:11]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0What the\u00a0[Bleep]?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:08:13]\u00a0<\/span><b>Finn:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Dude–<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:08:13]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Ford is never advertising with me, by the way. Every time I talk about them, I eviscerate them. Ford what?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:08:20]\u00a0<\/span><b>Finn:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0It’s a Ford Escape hybrid.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:08:22]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Okay. How much did it cost, just out of curiosity?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:08:25]\u00a0<\/span><b>Finn:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0I think it was about $38,000.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:08:27]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Okay. Do you guys run any numbers before you bought it?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:08:29]\u00a0<\/span><b>Luna:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0We looked for a really good deal on the kind of car that we wanted. One of the major selling points was it has a panoramic sunroof, and I actually wanted a brand-new car. But then again, Finn said we should just get a used one that’s just a couple of years old that’s going to be just as good.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:08:50]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Okay. That probably good advice.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:08:52]\u00a0<\/span><b>Luna:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Yeah.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:08:52]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0All right. So you got the car. I’m going to look at your numbers in a second. There’s a conversation the two of you have been having about buying a house, right? What’s the conversation?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:09:02]\u00a0<\/span><b>Luna:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Right. So it’s not actually a house that we want. I would like property or land so that we can have a yoga retreat center, because I also teach yoga. So yeah, it would be more than a house. It would be a source of income as well.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:09:20]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Okay. And do you agree, Finn, or what’s your take?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:09:25]\u00a0<\/span><b>Finn:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Living in the Bay Area, I don’t think that it’s realistic for us. If we had a million dollars tomorrow, I would rather buy, let’s say a house in Florida for half of that and keep the other half invested. She in the dreamer category, and so that’s part of the reason why I got attracted to your material, is because I understand that we need to have an actual plan. But it’s something that– we’re unsophisticated with money.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:10:05]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Okay. I appreciate that. Would you agree that you are a dreamer?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:10:12]\u00a0<\/span><b>Luna:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Yeah.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:10:13]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Wow. Okay, hold on. This is a rare moment, everybody. Give it up. [Applause]<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:10:18]\u00a0<\/span><b>Luna:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Luna. Woo.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:10:19]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Hold on. I am loving this. First of all, dreamers don’t come in front of me. Seeing a dreamer is very rare. They don’t come in the same room as I, and then they never, ever admit that they are a dreamer. I love that you’re admitting it. So for everybody who’s not familiar with a dreamer, a dreamer believes that success is one gig, one deal around the corner. They often fall into MLM schemes, scams. Is that true, MLM?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:10:54]\u00a0<\/span><b>Finn:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0I talked her out of it because I saw it from a mile away. I really want to support my wife in everything, but not– it was maybe the only time I’ve ever put my foot down about anything.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:11:08]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Okay.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:11:08]\u00a0<\/span><b>Luna:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Besides the van.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[Laughter]<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:11:09]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0So great. But I love that you’re honest about it. So here’s the thing though. For dreamers themselves, it’s often great. We can do this. We can do that. They float from one thing to another. It’s very difficult for the partner of a dreamer because the partner of a dreamer often just wants their partner to come up with a plan and be realistic.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:11:34]\u00a0And sometimes dreamers are subsidized by others. What do I mean by subsidized? Maybe they have an inheritance. That’s an example, or they have a partner who earns money. You earn money too. Totally acknowledge that. But often if their partner left or was hit by a bus, the dreamer would very quickly have to adapt to reality in order to not live in the clouds, but to live in reality.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:11:58]\u00a0So that is what a dreamer is. I love that we are getting to have this opportunity to talk, especially because– yeah, you can set yourself up for a future that is really, really positive, and you can still do the things you love. So I love this. What is the dynamic around spending money? Do the two of you spend money similarly?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:12:18]\u00a0<\/span><b>Finn:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0I would say that I’m more conservative with my money.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:12:20]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Okay. Luna?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:12:22]\u00a0<\/span><b>Luna:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Yeah, I am pretty free with my money. I like to buy gifts for him and people in my life. I’m pretty frugal when it comes to myself besides my supplements and my food intake. But I’m not really extravagant as far as clothes or handbags or shoes or anything like that. But it’s more so, I bought him $250 pants.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:12:52]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Those ones?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:12:53]\u00a0<\/span><b>Luna:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0These ones. Occasionally–<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:12:58]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0[Inaudible].<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:12:58]\u00a0<\/span><b>Finn:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Those are also $250. Those were also the–<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:13:02]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Do you live close to how much you make you spend?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:13:08]\u00a0<\/span><b>Luna:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Pretty much.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:13:09]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Okay. And is that regardless of how much you make?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:13:13]\u00a0<\/span><b>Luna:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0I suppose so, yeah. I guess that’s how it’s always been. Now I feel blessed to have something to fall back on if something happened. But if I have the money, for example, in my checking account, then it will get spent until it gets replenished.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:13:33]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Wow. Okay. All right. Let’s take a look at your numbers. All right.\u00a0So assets,\u00a020k.\u00a0Investments, 240,000.\u00a0That’s cool.\u00a0We’re\u00a0going to\u00a0come back to that.\u00a0Savings,\u00a060k.\u00a0No debt. I love that. Gross annual income is just under\u00a0100k.\u00a0Fixed\u00a0cost of 67%.\u00a0Investments at 0%. Now that is quite interesting because you see 0% invested, but yet you have 240,000 invested. So that’s roughly the 200k minus the Ford that you wasted– excuse me,\u00a0purchased. And then what else is in that investments?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:14:19]\u00a0<\/span><b>Finn:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Oh, I bought Bitcoin.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:14:24]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Okay. How much?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:14:25]\u00a0<\/span><b>Finn:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Half of that is–<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:14:26]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0What? How much?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:14:31]\u00a0<\/span><b>Finn:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0160,000.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:14:34]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0160,000 of 240 is Bitcoin?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:14:38]\u00a0<\/span><b>Finn:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Yeah. And hey, that’s why I want to talk to you, man, because I’ve only–<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:14:42]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0What the\u00a0[Bleep]\u00a0is going on right now?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:14:44]\u00a0<\/span><b>Finn:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Say crypto out of your head one time and–<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:14:46]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Okay, okay, okay, okay. I get it. What else? What else do you guys have in this investment account?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:14:52]\u00a0<\/span><b>Finn:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0So that’s about 100 or about 90 of her original stocks. We spent the other on the car, and then some of that sitting in cash somewhere. Okay. And then–<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:15:04]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Did you cash out any of the investments?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:15:08]\u00a0<\/span><b>Luna:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Yes.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:15:09]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0How much?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:15:10]\u00a0<\/span><b>Luna:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0About a total of 100.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:15:15]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Out of 200?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:15:16]\u00a0<\/span><b>Luna:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Right.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:15:16]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Why?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:15:18]\u00a0<\/span><b>Luna:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0I actually just am not really sure that stocks are super stable, and so I thought two in the hand is worth one in the bush, so I took it out just in case, like if it were to crash or something. Then at least I would have half of it.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:15:37]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Okay, okay. I don’t agree with that, but I understand it. So we’ll talk about that. But I appreciate the honesty. What else do you guys have in your investments?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:15:50]\u00a0<\/span><b>Finn:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Oh yeah, I got some gold.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:15:53]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0You have gold?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:15:54]\u00a0<\/span><b>Finn:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Yeah, a little bit. That’s how much I have.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:15:56]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0How much is that?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:15:58]\u00a0<\/span><b>Finn:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0It’s about 16, 2,000, something like that.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:16:03]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0All right. Am I the only one who’s underwhelmed by what gold looks like?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:16:07]\u00a0<\/span><b>Finn:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0No, dude.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:16:08]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0That’s 1,600 bucks of gold?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:16:09]\u00a0<\/span><b>Finn:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0I’m surprised as well. Yeah.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:16:11]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0All right. And then I understand you all have $2,000 in psychedelic stocks. What the [Bleep] is that?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:16:20]\u00a0<\/span><b>Finn:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Yeah, it’s more like four.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:16:22]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0What is it?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:16:23]\u00a0<\/span><b>Finn:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0We took a couple thousand dollars from our wedding gifts and we bought mushroom stocks. You’ve never been on shroom stocks on Reddit. I’m sure.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:16:33]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0No, I have not. I have not stumbled across that sub-Reddit. Hold on. I have a friend who does a lot of drugs and I told her, I don’t know anything about drugs at all. I missed it. And I was like, I’m so glad I didn’t really get into drugs. And she was like, why? And I was like, because I made money and that’s a really fast way for someone who has a lot of money to lose it, drugs. And she looked at me like I was so stupid.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:17:06]\u00a0She goes, how much do you think coke is? Now, the last time I saw coke anywhere was in RoboCop in 1987. Do you inject it? I don’t know even how to take it And I was like, I don’t know, $4,000 for a bank. She looked at me like I am the dumbest person an, she goes, it’s like $50. And I was like, wow, capital markets are so efficient. This is amazing.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:17:36]\u00a0<\/span><b>Finn:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0We would never invest in cocaine.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:17:38]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Only in SF. Okay. Can I just be a little bit directive with what I might suggest? Okay. Let’s put those numbers back up on screen. So first of all, I want to say I love that we are having this conversation early. My suggestion is that you’ll have a chance to have a very successful Rich Life together.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:18:08]\u00a0In order to do that, you’ll need to understand the basic language of money. And that means that both of you will have to learn it. So that when you say things like, oh, we should put it in a savings account or an investment account, you both know what that is. I think that’s going to be important. I also think little language like compound interest, what is that? Or Luna, when you said, “I want to pull it out because it feels safer. I’m worried.” I would like you to read Chapter 6 and to understand what’s the implication.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:18:37]\u00a0<\/span><b>Luna:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Actually, interestingly enough, I have a business degree from UC Santa Cruz. And yeah, they really didn’t actually teach us practical anything. It’s crazy.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:18:49]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Yeah, it is. And you’re a yoga teacher. So imagine that someone who’s just getting into health and wellness goes, “Oh, I have a shoulder ache. I’m going to go ask Luna for help.” And you’re like, “There’s physical therapist.” To the outside, it just all looks the same. To the outside business, all looks the same, but when you get into it, you realize, oh my gosh, personal finance is so different than business.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:19:12]\u00a0So that’s what I want to challenge you to do. I want the two of you to learn the language of money. I want the two of you to start talking about money regularly together. I know that, Finn, you wrote in your application, “We’ve basically disagreed about how we spend, where we should live, and planned to buy a house every step of the way. I just gave in and stopped fighting about it.” For now, it’s funny. But over 10, 20, 30 years, it’s less funny. It’s a wedge.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:19:44]\u00a0<\/span><b>Finn:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0I feel like when I talk about having a plan with money or I talk about optimizing money, for example, it’s met with, I’m stressing about money. It’s misunderstood as I’m being unreasonable when I really just want to have a plan. After doing our conscious spending plan, as you know, I realized how out of touch I was with our real numbers, and I want to live our dreams together.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:20:15]\u00a0And so I want us to understand that there’s a difference between trying to live our dreams and actually designing a plan that we implement to bring us to those dreams. And I know that we can do it together.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:20:33]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Could not have said it better myself. Okay. Read the book. Have the conversations. Keep me updated. Thank you so much for coming out here.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[Applause]<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:20:40]\u00a0<\/span><b>Finn:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Thank you, buddy.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:20:41]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Awesome. Awesome to meet you. Thank you so much.\u00a0Give it up for Finn and Luna.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[Applause]<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[Narration]<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:20:50]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0I really loved\u00a0this conversation, so please make sure you stick around until the end to see their follow-ups. I don’t often get the chance to speak to people at the initial parts of their financial journey. A lot of times by the time they get to me, they’ve read a little bit, they’ve learned a little bit, they have a bit of an understanding about the basics.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:21:08]\u00a0But honestly, I love the chance to talk to people at the beginning. I also liked\u00a0that this couple was different than some of the couples I speak to. Sometimes some of the couples I talk to are tracking 34,000 rows of data. Finn and Luna were different. They were in the clouds, which was quite fascinating.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:21:26]\u00a0I’m also struck by the kind of lifestyle they have built. It’s not just about money.\u00a0It’s about identity. They’ve spent years being alternative, being creative, living outside the box. I actually want them to keep that.\u00a0Stay creative.\u00a0Preserve that.\u00a0That is who they are, mushroom stocks, gold coins, and all.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:21:45]\u00a0But what I want them to do is to add a new layer on top of that, a new part of their identity, one that says, we can still dream,\u00a0and we can plan. And truthfully, I wish that I had embraced that mindset in my own relationship earlier. Back then, I thought being good with money meant we agree on the percentage of our investment contributions.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:22:07]\u00a0Okay, we probably should. But what I really needed to do was to close my mouth and listen to how my wife felt about money and what her invisible scripts were and what money means to her. In fact, I probably needed to figure out how to express my own feelings and not just what I thought. Had I done that, it would’ve saved us years of difficult conversations.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:22:31]\u00a0And speaking of my relationship,\u00a0up next,\u00a0before we meet our next couple, you’re\u00a0going to\u00a0meet my wife Cassandra. I think you’re\u00a0going to\u00a0be surprised because I broke one of our cardinal rules with money,\u00a0and she did not let it slide. She actually called me out on it.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[Applause]<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[Interview]<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:22:47]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Let’s give it up. Okay, welcome. How does it feel to be on stage?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:23:05]\u00a0<\/span><b>Cassandra:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0It feels good. Hey, everyone. How’s it going?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:23:09]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Okay,\u00a0I have a few questions for you about our relationship.\u00a0Let’s just start at the beginning.\u00a0What is it like being married to an optimizer?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:23:23]\u00a0<\/span><b>Cassandra:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Yes, being married to an optimizer, I would say that it took some time for us to get used to each other with our money dials and how we approached money. But now I can say it’s a real strength that Ramit is an optimizer,\u00a0and I do appreciate that he loves to run a compound interest calculator for fun.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:23:46]\u00a0And he does love a good spreadsheet as well. And so that has been a really fun part of our journey to learn about. But there was one thing I was very surprised about.\u00a0I thought optimizers were really good at Excel,\u00a0and Ramit does not know basic formulas, so I’m still\u00a0waiting.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:24:08]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0She looked at my spreadsheets and she’s like–\u00a0I was so excited. I’m like,\u00a0“Babe, look at this calculate.”\u00a0And she’s like,\u00a0“Who the fuck designed\u00a0this thing?\u00a0It’s\u00a0so ugly.”\u00a0She\u00a0actually runs our family calculations,\u00a0and you manage that part of it in an amazing way.\u00a0So that when we talk about the numbers,\u00a0you have them up.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:24:29]\u00a0<\/span><b>Cassandra:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Yeah. I love a good spreadsheet, so I am like boop, boop, boop. Okay, here we go. And it’s all good. But it has definitely been a journey to get here. And even just in fact recently,\u00a0we had a little hiccup. Do you\u00a0want to\u00a0share about\u00a0that?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:24:41]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Yeah. So we have our monthly money meetings. But you pointed out recently, very recently,\u00a0you’re like,\u00a0“Hey, can I talk to you about something?”\u00a0I am responsible for the monthly money meetings. And you pointed out that I have been letting them slide. I haven’t been scheduling them and sometimes they just don’t happen. And you made a very accurate, but it was tough for me to hear point, which was,\u00a0“You would never miss a work meeting, so why would you miss this meeting? Which is even more important than that.”<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:25:16]\u00a0And that’s real. That’s real.\u00a0And yeah, I appreciated the way that you brought it up\u00a0because\u00a0you were very compassionate, but you were real. And I think\u00a0I\u00a0got the gravity of it because how can I be writing a book and then I’m missing our own monthly money meeting?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:25:38]\u00a0We deconstructed it and I was like,\u00a0“Let’s try to figure out why.”\u00a0And one of the big lessons was,\u00a0we scheduled our meeting at\u00a06:00\u00a0or 8:00 PM.\u00a0I don’t really schedule many work meetings at 8:00 PM because they would get skipped\u00a0because\u00a0we’re tired. So we moved it to a better time. We clarified what we’re talking about.\u00a0We streamlined all this stuff. And I think that was a good wake-up call,\u00a0and I really appreciated how you delivered that.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:26:08]\u00a0<\/span><b>Cassandra:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Yeah.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:26:08]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Yeah. So thanks. Thank you. I think it’s a good lesson that you’re always\u00a0going to\u00a0be working to tweak and improve things and life is\u00a0going to\u00a0get in the way sometimes.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:26:19]\u00a0<\/span><b>Cassandra:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Yeah.\u00a0So\u00a0you\u00a0really have to fight to maintain focus on what’s important.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:26:24]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Yeah,\u00a0yeah. Okay. How did it feel when we started combining finances?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:26:29]\u00a0<\/span><b>Cassandra:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Yeah. For me it was very nerve wracking because we grew up very differently with money,\u00a0and we saw things differently. And speaking of growing up with money, my mom and dad are in the audience.\u00a0Are\u00a0you there? Where are\u00a0you?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:26:46]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Can\u00a0we\u00a0see them? Mom and dad, can you stand up?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:26:48]\u00a0<\/span><b>Cassandra:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Oh yeah. Stand up,\u00a0so everyone could say hi.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:26:51]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0There they are. Give\u00a0them\u00a0round of applause.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:26:55]\u00a0<\/span><b>Cassandra:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Yeah. There’s my mom and dad.\u00a0They’re great. But yeah,\u00a0we grew up very differently with money.\u00a0And so through a lot of conversations, easy and hard ones, we have improved our communication around that,\u00a0and now we have a good system in place.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:27:11]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0What do you wish you knew back then that you know now?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:27:18]\u00a0<\/span><b>Cassandra:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Yeah, the biggest thing I would say is how much individual work we had to do on our money psychology. And I really did.\u00a0I dove into books. I hired a money mindset coach. I did so many things.\u00a0And because of that individual work, it really, really helped us lay a very strong foundation going forward.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:27:39]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0That is very true. You did a ton of work on your relationship with money.\u00a0You hired a coach. I didn’t even know about that until a year or two later. And it showed up. It showed up in our conversations. And I know you also told me like,\u00a0hey, I need you to work better on connecting with your feelings.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:28:02]\u00a0<\/span><b>Cassandra:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0The f word,\u00a0feelings.\u00a0My favorite thing.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:28:06]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0I’ve come to appreciate it. We have our wheel. We have our wheel.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:28:11]\u00a0<\/span><b>Cassandra:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Oh, yeah.\u00a0Oh.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:28:13]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0So this is on our fridge.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:28:15]\u00a0<\/span><b>Cassandra:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Tell them what this is.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:28:17]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Okay. This is the wheel of emotions. We got it from a therapist,\u00a0and it’s really helpful. You could take a picture of it. This is something I find,\u00a0especially men–\u00a0there were words on here. I was like,\u00a0“Huh?\u00a0What does this mean?”\u00a0Or a word that I would never use in a conversation. But I think this is the kind of thing you encouraged me to learn,\u00a0and we are doing it together.\u00a0And it’s given us a new language together.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:28:41]\u00a0<\/span><b>Cassandra:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Yeah, absolutely. And now because of all the work we put in individually and together, we have fun when we talk about money.\u00a0And yeah, there’s hard times and stuff, but overall we’re on the same path moving forward.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:28:52]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0All right. Thank you so much. I love you. Let’s give it up.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[Narration]<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:28:55]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0I\u00a0hope that you seeing Cassandra talk about money shows you\u00a0that\u00a0this entire body of work is not just theoretical. I’ve lived it. We’ve lived it. We’re living it right now. As I record this, I just finished a money meeting with my wife where we looked through our numbers, and we discussed what’s working. We made plans for our next meeting. I’m sharing this because I’m not lecturing you from the clouds.\u00a0I’m actually doing this with you.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:29:21]\u00a0That is why I have so much compassion for the guests on this show.\u00a0Because if it’s hard for Cassandra and me, I know how hard this is for you. So if money feels hard for you, if sometimes you feel stuck or like you’re not aligned with your partner or even with yourself, my wish is that you give yourself a little grace.\u00a0Yeah,\u00a0sometimes it’s hard, and yes, you also can improve your relationship with money so money feels good.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:29:48]\u00a0Up next, I’m speaking to Monica and Antonio. They have a high income. They also have an invisible pressure to take care of their parents, which I think will resonate with a lot of you.\u00a0If you grew up in an immigrant household, you already know what that kind of invisible pressure feels like. I’m now looking at their conscious spending plan,\u00a0and if you want help with your own conscious spending plan, you can join my\u00a0Money\u00a0Coaching program at iwt.com\/moneycoaching.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:30:14]\u00a0Assets, 42,000.\u00a0Investments, 200,000. Savings, 141,000.\u00a0Debt 25,000.\u00a0For a total net worth of $359,480. They have a combined income of 235,000, which is very impressive. But they don’t feel like it’s enough. Not even close,\u00a0actually.\u00a0Let’s get into it.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[Interview]<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:30:36]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0I’d like for you to get on your feet and welcome Monica and Antonio. [Applause]<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:30:43]\u00a0Yes. Welcome. How you doing? Thank you for being here. Thank you. Have a seat.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:30:53]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0How are you doing?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:30:55]\u00a0<\/span><b>Antonio:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Good.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:30:55]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Doing good.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:30:56]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0How you feeling?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:30:57]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Excited, but also nervous.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:30:59]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Nervous?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:30:59]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Yeah.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:31:00]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0We had the best community anywhere, and I’m so thankful that y’all came out here and you are asking for help. In your application, you wrote, “How do we structure, our finances to be able to start saving for our future, but also to help our parents in the next five years?” Can you tell me a little bit about the circumstances around helping your parents?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:31:26]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Yes. So my parents immigrated to the US maybe 38 years ago from Mexico. They left their family, their friends, their country of origin, and decided to move for me and my sister and come to the US because things were not going well economically. But they had a comfortable life in Mexico.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:31:47]\u00a0And they moved here with a small amount of savings and started their own business and figured out how to start. And they ultimately ended up owning a series of small businesses. But in 2008, all of their savings was gone overnight. They weren’t really ever able to recoup from that. They’re able to pay their bills and take care of themselves, but ultimately they mean a lot to me.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:32:19]\u00a0They gave up their whole lives, what they thought was going to be their life for me and my sister, and sacrificed that. And it is super important to me that they know that they’re going to be taken care of. This was never their plan, for them to not have the savings or retirement to lean on.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:32:39]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Okay, I appreciate that. How do you feel when you think about the journey that your parents took?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:32:47]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Really emotional. It took a lot of courage to own a small business and then it not do so well and reinvent themselves and create another small business to give my sister and I a middle class life here in the US. And that meant everything to them. They wanted us to have the opportunities and to grow and to learn and be in a community that would support us and give us a bright future.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:33:16]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Okay, okay. Thank you. What is your goal to help your parents? You mentioned something in the next five years.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:33:24]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0I don’t know when they’re going to be able or how long they’re going to be able to continue with their small business. They’re in their 70s, and I imagine at some point health or otherwise, or their business is no longer profitable, they’re going to need financial help. So I want to be prepared for that. I don’t want to be reactive, but I also don’t know what I need to do or where to go.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:33:51]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Okay. Do you feel pressure to take care of them?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:33:55]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0I would say yes, but I also feel like it’s an honor to take care of my parents. They came here for me and my sister. So yeah, there’s definitely some pressure there.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:34:06]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0I think anyone who’s close to their parents, and certainly someone who’s seen their parents come from a different country and understand even the sliver of how difficult that would have to be, can understand the advantages that we got growing up here. Okay, I think I understand. Let me ask you first, Monica, and then I want to come to you, Antonio. What did you learn about money growing up in your household?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:34:37]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0That we couldn’t afford a lot of things.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:34:39]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0How did you learn that?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:34:41]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Because it’s what I was told.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:34:44]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Any phrases you remember specifically?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:34:49]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Yeah, can’t afford it. There was disagreements frequently regarding money in my household. Yeah.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:34:55]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Among your parents?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:34:57]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Yes. Among my parents.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:34:58]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Okay. And what did you feel about money as a kid?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:35:02]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Stress?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:35:03]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Ah. You still feel that?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:35:05]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0I still feel that.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:35:07]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Okay. Antonio, what do you remember about money as a kid?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:35:12]\u00a0<\/span><b>Antonio:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0With my parents, there was a sense of people with money attained that money in a negative way or they stepped on people to get to where they were, or it was a very evil type of mentality around it.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:35:30]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0What does that mean?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:35:32]\u00a0<\/span><b>Antonio:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0That they did things that necessarily weren’t right or righteous or the right way, or they took advantage of people or stepped on people to get in front of them or take advantage in some other way.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:35:48]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0So the story that you were taught was, if somebody has a lot of money, they did something wrong in order to get it. They had to take advantage. That’s a less common one than we can’t afford it, but it sticks with you, doesn’t it? you still feel that way?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:36:07]\u00a0<\/span><b>Antonio:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Fortunately, I don’t. Actually, I grew up in Arizona, and then I actually went to San Diego for college. I played soccer and went to a private school where there was a lot of affluent students and people and families. And it opened my eyes up to a whole new world in terms of getting to know people and their identities and that money isn’t evil, and that money can do great things. And it just depends on the person and their identity and what they can do. So really, getting out of Arizona was like my ticket to explore the world, and it was huge for me.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:36:49]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Okay. That connects with me a lot. I grew up going to public school, and I don’t know where I got this idea but I had this idea that if you go to private school, you’re an\u00a0[Bleep]\u00a0and spoiled. And then I got to college and there were a lot of my classmates who had gone to private school, public school, whatever. That was not true.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:37:16]\u00a0I changed my opinion in 48 hours of becoming a freshman. And at 17 or 18 years old when you realize, oh my god, something I believed for the last 10 years is actually totally untrue, it’s earth shaking. So I appreciate. That’s the power of being surrounded by different people. Okay. How are your parents with money, Antonio?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:37:41]\u00a0<\/span><b>Antonio:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0I came from a family of six, five boys, one girl. So it was more of a survive instead of nurture. So it was dad working a few jobs, mom staying at home, just constantly working, but then providing for us. We didn’t know any different. This was the good life. So it was seeing all those sacrifices that they made, but then knowing at certain times you couldn’t afford things.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:38:15]\u00a0I played on club teams where I would have other people that would pay for tournaments and things like that that would make up the difference because my family, we couldn’t afford it. But the skill sets and being an athlete helped.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:38:30]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0How about now? How are they with money now?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:38:35]\u00a0<\/span><b>Antonio:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0It’s a divided family now. So there was a divorce, and there’s some division in the family. Things happen, and you adjust. So my dad, similar to her parents, are looking to help him and take care of him because of what he’s done throughout my life and our lives to help support him. He’s a Vietnam vet and been through a lot of trauma and PTSD, and all those other things that come along with the sacrifices that he made, not only for our country, but for us.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:39:11]\u00a0That we have an obligation and a duty. And I think Monica downplays her stress and weight of the responsibility, because of all the sacrifice that her parents made. I think she takes on a huge weight, and it’s been seen in her drive and her career to make it worth what her parents sacrificed. So there’s a lot of weight there and pressure.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:39:39]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Do you agree with that, Monica?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:39:41]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Yeah. So we recently combine our households with my parents. They are doing it for me and my husband, for Antonio and I and our son,\u00a0[Bleep]. Because they remember how stressful it was for them. And there was a lot of anxiety and worry in the household.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:40:08]\u00a0Because they moved here and didn’t have anybody, they didn’t have anyone to rely on, and they want to be that for us. So I’m so grateful and thankful that they not only want to be a part of our lives, but intimately involved to help and support us in a way that they didn’t have. But yeah, we all lived together.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:40:29]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Okay, that’s cool. And you want to figure out how you can continue that and I think get a house with an ADU so that your parents can live in it. Is that right?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:40:42]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Yeah, that is our long term or a longer-term goal, I think.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:40:48]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Okay. At some point you want to have a house with an ADU. Okay.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[Narration]<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:40:52]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0As I was hearing Monica and Antonio describe how they experienced money when they were young,\u00a0the way that I was feeling was sad. I noticed a sad tone around money coming from them, but I could also feel it inside my own body.\u00a0And I think I can understand why. If you grew up with immigrant parents,\u00a0I’m willing to bet you probably didn’t talk about money as openly as we do on this show.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:41:18]\u00a0But I also bet those quiet expectations were always there. They go something like this,\u00a0“We came here for you,\u00a0and one day you’ll take care of us.”\u00a0In a lot of families, especially immigrant families, that idea just exists.\u00a0It’s in the air. It may never be explicitly said, but\u00a0it’s well understood by everybody.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:41:39]\u00a0But Monica and Antonio are part of two cultures now. In one culture, that expectation is sacred. Anyone who grew up with immigrant parents knows what I’m talking about.\u00a0In the other culture, money is something you talk about,\u00a0plan for,\u00a0even set boundaries around.\u00a0This is cultural. It’s socioeconomic. It cuts across different groups of people with an invisible knife that nonetheless leaves real expectations. And that’s where things get really tricky because they’ve never had that conversation.\u00a0It’s all been unspoken.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:42:18]\u00a0Have you ever read some of these Reddit threads where an Indian kid or a Chinese kid will say,\u00a0“Hey, I’m not sure.\u00a0My parents expect me to do this, but I’m just not sure about it.”\u00a0And 99% of the people in that comment thread would be like,”[Bleep]\u00a0them.\u00a0You need to take care of yourself.”\u00a0And I’m like,\u00a0“Have y’all ever met an immigrant family?”\u00a0No?\u00a0A lot of you think something is real\u00a0only if it’s documented in SOP.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:42:40]\u00a0Oh my, I cannot comply with your request because you did not properly format according to our standard operating procedure.\u00a0Get a life you\u00a0[\u200aBleep]\u00a0corporate drone. That’s not how real life works. People go 50 years never talking about something, but their expectations are as real as the air around us.\u00a0So you may not understand these expectations, but they are real for tens of millions of people around the world. Now listen, as Monica describes how she feels about money.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[Interview]<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:43:08]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0How would you describe your relationship with money in a word?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:43:11]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Can I use two words?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:43:13]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Sure.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:43:15]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Push, pull.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:43:16]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Oh, what does that mean?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:43:18]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0I think sometimes when I’m very conscientious and intentional with my money, I feel good and happy about it. But when I avoid or get overwhelmed, I get very anxious because I don’t know what’s going on in our financial picture.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:43:38]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0It sounds pretty stressful to me. I haven’t heard a lot of joy in the way that you describe money. Is that fair?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:43:46]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Yeah. I think there are moments of joy. I think the last six or eight months have just been a little bit more stressful financially for a lot of reasons. And so maybe that’s why it’s coming off that way, but yeah.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:44:00]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0It’s okay. Things come in waves. They come in chapters. I don’t mind that. I think, from what you described, your parents had a tough time when they came here with money. Understandably so. Would you say you have a tough time financially speaking? Are you thriving? Are you just getting by? Are you failing with money? Which one?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:44:24]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0I would say I don’t think we’re failing. But I don’t think we’re surviving. For sure, we’re not surviving. So I feel like somewhere in between.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:44:34]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Getting by?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:44:34]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Getting by.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:44:35]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Okay. Shall we take a look at the numbers.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:44:37]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Sure.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:44:38]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Okay, let’s put them up.\u00a0Assets of\u00a042,000.\u00a0Investments of 200,000. Savings of 141.\u00a0Debt’s,\u00a025. I think that’s a van you bought.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:44:49]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Yes.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:44:50]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Is that right? Okay. Why do you say it like that?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:44:51]\u00a0<\/span><b>Antonio:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Very aggressive, very manly van.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:44:55]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0I love a good van. I drove a van for so many years. Any minivan drivers in the room? I feel like we have a disproportionate number of Honda minivan drivers in this room.\u00a0Gross monthly income is 19k.\u00a0That’s really good.\u00a0Fixed costs\u00a0at 68%. What do y’all think about that number? What do you guys think? You’re looking at it like it’s the first time looking at those numbers. What the hell? You sent these numbers.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:45:24]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0High. It’s high.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:45:26]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Okay. Yes, it’s high. If it’s 68, we could probably bring it down, especially with a high income like that. I agree. I typically like to see 50 to 60, especially with a high income. Y’all agree you have a high income?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:45:39]\u00a0<\/span><b>Antonio:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0We don’t feel like it.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:45:40]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0No, we don’t feel like it.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:45:41]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Do we really have to do this thing again? Hold on. Gross annual income, $234,000. Yeah, that’s it. That’s a high income. And don’t pull that\u00a0[Bleep]\u00a0on me. Not in San Francisco. Come on. Okay, so you don’t feel it. Is there a number that you would feel it?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:46:07]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Yeah.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:46:09]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0What’s the number?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:46:10]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0I don’t know. 40k a month.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:46:12]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a040k a month. Where’d that come from?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:46:16]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Just twice as much as what we have.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:46:21]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0God. One day I’m going to encounter someone who just goes, “Yes, I have enough.” Please. How many more decades will it take me to find that person?\u00a0All right. So fixed cost is 68.\u00a0Investments at zero. That’s\u00a0interesting.\u00a0Savings\u00a0at 1%.\u00a0Guilt-free spending at 31%. What? What are y’all spending on?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:46:45]\u00a0<\/span><b>Antonio:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0A lot.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:46:45]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0The answer is not behind you. Trust me. What are you spending on? I don’t mind spending on nice things. I like them, but I’m just curious. 31%? What are you spending on?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:46:59]\u00a0<\/span><b>Antonio:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0We have certain expenses that is–<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:47:01]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Like?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:47:01]\u00a0<\/span><b>Antonio:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0There’s healthcare. Not healthcare, but her working out. We have certain investments towards trainers, health, organic food.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:47:16]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0All right. self-care.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:47:17]\u00a0<\/span><b>Antonio:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Self-care.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:47:19]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0What else? Got real quiet in here all of a sudden.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:47:22]\u00a0<\/span><b>Antonio:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0We do have a kid, the 18 month old.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:47:24]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Okay. I know childcare is a big expense under your fixed costs. It’s\u00a01,900\u00a0bucks a month.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:47:30]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Correct.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:47:30]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0That’s a lot.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:47:31]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0And that’s not that expensive for San Diego?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:47:35]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Yeah, yeah. Okay. Antonio, you started contributing to retirement later in life. You’re 12 years older than Monica. And Monica, you recently scaled back hours at work. Have you changed your spending to reflect the hours that you’ve cut?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:47:56]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Honestly, no. And I didn’t really realize that until maybe a month ago when we started combing through all of our finances and I realized, oh, I never made that adjustment.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:48:09]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Yeah, that’s common. That’s common. That’s very common. It’s like the NFL player who stops being in the NFL, but they don’t change what they’re eating or how they’re spending. It’s very common. And so at least you recognize it now. So you want to buy a house? From looking at your num numbers, what do you think? What’s the answer?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:48:31]\u00a0<\/span><b>Antonio:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0I don’t think we have enough saved. There’s also some fears where the last five, six years we had planned the whole a compound with the ADU, and that was a dream. But then you look at the real estate market, you look at interest rates, and we have histories of being burned in real estate. Her parents have that history.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:48:56]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Both families.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:48:56]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Both families.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:48:58]\u00a0<\/span><b>Antonio:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0My parents. I even went through it in 2008 in terms of the crash and had a couple of homes and went through that. So there’s a bit of a fear in terms of not making– and then you have a child and we’re raising a family. It’s like, you don’t want to make that same mistake.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:49:12]\u00a0And I think we’ve done so many things to improve our relationship as people in terms of going to therapy and these things in terms of changing behaviors. We love our parents, but there’s certain behaviors that we want to change to instill in our life as we go forward. And we want to do that with the finances as well.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:49:36]\u00a0And listening to you, it brought up the point of like, maybe a house isn’t the investment that we want to go. Maybe there’s other options and maybe there’s other ways that are more secure and help us attain that Rich Life in the ways that we want to experience it.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:49:54]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0I think that’s probably true, especially because you live in a very high cost of living city and I think because you’re hyper aware of real estate, what’s been the family history. But I guess I want to zoom out for a second. I want to say the two of you, parents have given you a lot in terms of knowledge.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:50:19]\u00a0They’ve given you generational wealth, not maybe through money, but generational wealth through opportunities and through teaching you and introducing you to new ideas and people. So the first thing I just want to recognize is that you are doing very well relative to most people in America. Do you recognize that?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:50:41]\u00a0<\/span><b>Antonio:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0I’m more self-aware. She’s more critical of herself with just the behavior and the responsibility that she has and has been instilled with her.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:50:49]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Let me ask you, Monica. Do you recognize that? Can we put those numbers back up?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:50:56]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0I hear you.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:50:57]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Mm-hmm.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:50:59]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0But the honest answer is no.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:51:01]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Okay. Fair answer. So you hear me. You can even see these numbers with a lot of zeros. There’s a lot. Investments, 200,000. Gross monthly income, almost 20,000. But you’re telling me you don’t feel it here.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:51:18]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Right.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:51:18]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Okay. Why do you think that is?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:51:23]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Because of the way that I grew up.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:51:24]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Probably.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[Narration]<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:51:26]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0It’s so interesting to me that such high earners can have such negative feelings about money.\u00a0Remember, the way we feel about money is highly uncorrelated with the amount in our bank account.\u00a0But now that we are starting to understand where they came from and how they watched their family struggle with money, it’s\u00a0starting to make more sense.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:51:46]\u00a0They’re setting these enormous goals for themselves, a property with an ADU,\u00a0help for Antonio’s father.\u00a0Yet have you noticed that nowhere in this conversation have they talked about the things they would like to spend money on for themselves? I’m also concerned about their own future. They have $200,000 earmarked for retirement, but Antonio’s 48 years old. I would like to see them focus on their own future as well as their parents.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:52:11]\u00a0Otherwise, you know what’s\u00a0going to\u00a0happen? This cycle will continue for yet another generation. In fact, there’s a very specific reason that Monica and Antonio feel behind, even though they are earning way more than most Americans. Listen, as I give them my perspective.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[Interview]<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:52:28]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0You grew up not having enough, feeling stressed about money. And then both of your parents lost houses and have gone through a variety of different financial journeys. Yet, combined the two of you make high income, household income. What I notice, there’s probably many reasons and definitely things to dig into with a therapist.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:52:58]\u00a0What I notice is that you have unconsciously set such a high bar that you can actually never be successful by that standard. Looking at the numbers, you’re quite successful. Yes, we can talk about your investments and guilt-free spending. We can do that. I’ll give you some quick things right now. But if your standard is I need to buy a house with an ADU in California for my parents, how many people can actually do that?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:53:30]\u00a0We all know how expensive that is, don’t we? That’s an almost impossible standard. So by setting that, you are unconsciously recreating that feeling of not having enough. The same one that feels so familiar that you grew up with, now making $240,000 a year, you’re still feeling it simply because you’re recreating that story. How does that strike you?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:53:58]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Never thought of it that way.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:54:01]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Tell me more.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:54:02]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Yeah, I think my whole life I’ve probably expected this and was trying to set myself up mentally for what it was going to take to get to that place. And it just feels like it’s never enough.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:54:20]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Right, right. What a tragedy to have accomplished as much as the two of you have and to never feel like it’s enough. I think there’s a very different way to look at it. First of all, is just appreciating what your parents gave you, what you two have taken and run with and accomplished. Huge, huge. Not many can say that. So that is the first thing.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:54:48]\u00a0And if I’m you, I’m spending a lot more time in conversations about money, talking about, look how far we’ve come. Look where we came from. I was walking around San Francisco today, and I lived here in my 20s, early 30s, and I was walking around my old neighborhood and just really taking it in with my wife. Look how far I came. Oh, I used to go to that coffee shop. And it felt good to look at that and then to contrast it with where I am. I appreciate where I came from. I would love for you to do the same.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:55:19]\u00a0On the financial side, I’m going to make a few more specific recommendations. If I’m looking at your spending, investing, etc., I think I would immediately take the guilt-free spending and I would probably cut it in half. And going through your guilt-free spending, it was quite detailed. You really laid it out. But there’s 0% going to investments.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:55:47]\u00a0So typically I say 20 to 35%. In your case, particularly since you started investing later in life, you can cut that quite a bit. 15% is a good place to start. Especially on your income, 15% is a lot. But all of that remainder of the money can go towards investments. You have a car payment. It’s going to be over in a couple of years, I think. 400 or so bucks a month. I would invest all of that directly. Don’t get a new car. Keep that as long as you can. If you can do all of those things, you’ll have over $2 million in retirement. It’s a good start.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:56:27]\u00a0It’s a good start for investing aggressively later in life. By the way, I’m going for the most conservative look, which is, Antonio, your retirement because you’re a little older. If you let that money sit, it will grow considerably. The house, realistically in the next five years, you’re not going to buy a house with an ADU. That’s okay.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:56:52]\u00a0Sometimes the best thing we can do with a Rich Life is to be honest with ourselves and the people around us. You don’t actually need to buy a house to achieve having your parents live with you altogether. Might be a little tighter than you wanted, but if you can get creative about it, that would be my challenge for you. Basically, I wouldn’t set a goal, if you want to live in California, of buying a house with an ADU, because you’ll forever feel behind. So find another way. Do you think that that’s possible?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:57:23]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Yeah, that’s fair.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:57:24]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Okay, okay. I think above all, we need the two of you to focus on your financial future, to get aligned. There’s a lot of family history. You want to honor your family. You want to take care of them. I totally respect that. I get it. But I also want you to have a plan, a plan, so that you are both taken care of with your retirement because the clock is ticking. And you got to feel good about it. You can’t go the next 17 years, 30 years feeling horrible. You just can’t. No one can run a marathon that long. And hate what they’re doing. So do you think that you can find a way to prioritize yourselves, do it together, and to feel good about your journey?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:58:09]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Yeah, I do.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:58:10]\u00a0<\/span><b>Antonio:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0I definitely think so.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:58:10]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0In the spirit of wanting you to change the way you feel about your journey, my team spoke to your parents, and I’d love for us to take a look.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:58:23]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica’s Dad:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0We are very proud that you guys are already\u00a0looking for an answer, looking for a plan, looking for a system that is\u00a0going to\u00a0get you where you want to go, and you guys are including us. I’m grateful. I’m proud. I think the torch has been passed, the values have been transferred. That alone\u00a0is enough,\u00a0more than enough. Make us feel really proud.\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:58:52]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica’s Mom:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0I love you both,\u00a0and we’re rooting for you. We’re wishing you the best. [Applause].<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:58:57]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0What do you see when you see your parents up there?<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:59:14]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0The people I love. The people who gave me the life that I have now.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:59:19]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Yeah. I think you’ve done an amazing job taking the torch, as your dad said, carrying it on. I want you two to put yourselves first, prioritize. You can still take care of your family, feel good along the way, and everyone else will be able to sense that feeling that the two of you have as a team.\u00a0Monica and Antonio, can we give it up for them? Thank you so much. [Applause] Thank you. Thank you very much. Thank you so much.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[Narration]<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[00:59:50]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Monica and Antonio are doing so many things right.\u00a0They’ve got strong careers, a great income, a deep commitment to their family, but they are also carrying this invisible burden, the pressure to make their parents’\u00a0sacrifices worth it.\u00a0And that’s when you can start to create unrealistic standards, like feeling that if you cannot buy a house with an ADU in California, you failed.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:00:15]\u00a0Let’s be honest. For the vast majority of people, that is not realistic. That feeling of not enough does not come from their incomes. It comes from the expectations they have invisibly internalized, but never really talked about. Now, when it comes to money, a lot of people resort to going right back to the budget.\u00a0We need a budget. We need to track a budget.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:00:36]\u00a0You don’t need a\u00a0[Bleep]\u00a0budget. What you actually need is a new story, a new way of looking at money, a new set of lenses to put on and then the systems to bring that story to life. If the story in your head is, I’m on my own, or I have to take care of everyone else, because if I don’t, I lose control and everything falls apart, then no budget in the world will ever make you feel safe.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:01:03]\u00a0Oh, it’s easy. You can certainly create a budget, change some numbers. Ugh. It can feel productive. I can knock it out in five seconds for you. But changing your story, that takes work. And that is where real meaningful change happens, especially for couples who are willing to rewrite their story together.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:01:24]\u00a0If you’re coming into the new year and you\u00a0want to\u00a0rewrite your story around money, if you\u00a0want to\u00a0stop feeling overwhelmed and behind, and you actually want to feel excited about money, even if you have debt, even if you’re not sure about what to do next, I want you to check out my\u00a0Money\u00a0Coaching program.\u00a0You’ll get access to me, my team, and a whole community of people who are\u00a0going to\u00a0help you stick to your\u00a0Rich Life\u00a0goals.\u00a0It’s not negative, punitive budgeting. It’s creating a\u00a0Rich Life. And you can join at iwt.com\/moneycoaching.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:01:57]\u00a0A huge thank you to both couples who were brave enough to join me on stage in front of our live San Francisco audience, and to my amazing, beautiful wife, Cassandra, who makes me want to continue rewriting our story together every single day. We’re\u00a0going to\u00a0get to their follow ups in just a second, and I want you to watch until the end, because we reached out to these couples a full year after this was recorded, so make sure you stick around.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:02:22]\u00a0First up, Finn and Luna.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:02:25]\u00a0<\/span><b>Luna:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0I’ve realized that I am quite a bit of a dreamer, and so I’m taking steps to become more of a planner, and that includes listening to, I\u00a0Will\u00a0Teach\u00a0You to\u00a0Be\u00a0Rich, and then following along with the steps at the end of the chapter.\u00a0So I can see myself aligning my goals with my husband’s goals, and we’re able to agree a lot more and disagree a lot less just since starting to create our\u00a0Rich Life.\u00a0So thank you so much to Ramit and thank you so much to his team, and we’ll keep you updated in the future. Peace.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:02:58]\u00a0<\/span><b>Finn:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0We have decided to do a study time every week with the book where we spend an hour of reading the book and making it to do list. So we’re just going through the book and going step by step and figuring things out, and I can feel it coming together,\u00a0and I’m so stoked to see what the next year of learning has in store for us.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:03:22]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0And now let’s hear from Monica and Antonio.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:03:25]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Since we last met, we reduced our everything else by 30 to 40%. Fully funded for both Antonio and myself Roth IRAs for last year, and are in the works of fully funding Roth IRAs for this year. We were able to start saving about 600 to $800 a month every month now. Our son’s daycare costs will reduce by about 40 to 50% in two months. So there’s light at the end of the tunnel as far as daycare costs. So we’ll be able to start saving around 1400, $1,500 monthly.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:04:03]\u00a0<\/span><b>Antonio:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0More.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:04:04]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0More,\u00a0yes.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:04:05]\u00a0<\/span><b>Antonio:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0In addition to what we’re saving.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:04:07]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Still working on my money mindset. Still very much love my parents and hope to be able to help them in the future. But putting ourselves first,\u00a0and we are in the process of looking for a financial advisor that works best for us. And we’ve interviewed a couple so far,\u00a0and we have a few more to interview to help us decide what to do with the rest of our savings.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:04:33]\u00a0<\/span><b>Ramit:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Now let’s hear from them a full year later and see what kind of progress they’ve made.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:04:39]\u00a0<\/span><b>Finn:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Well, it’s been about a year since Luna and I were on stage with Ramit. A lot has happened since then. When we walked out that night, we had nothing in place. We had no system. We never opened up an investment account. We had no IRAs. We’ve never had a credit card ever. And so it’s a year later and we’ve got all that in place.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:05:00]\u00a0We basically opened up the Charles Schwab investment account. We took the money out of our\u00a0[Bleep] banks and invested it into the S&P 500. We’ve got our conscious spending plan down to a perfect pie chart.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:05:12]\u00a0And then we send 10% of what we make for the month into our\u00a0[Bleep]\u00a0banks. So that’s our guilt-free spending. And then we invest the rest into the S&P 500. We took our toes out of the crypto game. We started to agree that building wealth shouldn’t be boring, and that was too much of a wild ride.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:05:30]\u00a0So we got out while we were on top and put that into the S&P 500. So, yeah, the best advice I could give anybody out there is to actually read the book and do the work, and you’ll find yourself in a different life, and it’s a much safer, better life for us. Yeah, we’re very grateful for that night.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:05:50]\u00a0<\/span><b>Antonio:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Hello, Ramit and team. We want to give you an update as far as you know what’s happened.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:05:56]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0So since we met in January, we were on the hunt for a financial advisor. We were able to fully fund last year’s Roth IRAs and started contributing towards our retirement funds in a larger amount monthly.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:06:13]\u00a0<\/span><b>Antonio:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0I did get laid off back in July, which has been a bit stressful, but the same time we had I guess the safety of the emergency fund to take some time off, rethink where I wanted to go in terms of next direction, next steps.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:06:29]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0I think for me, what’s changed the most in the last year with Antonio’s layoff, and my father had some serious heart health issues this year, my view on what our savings should go to and view on money has changed completely. I now see all of our savings as freedom.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:06:51]\u00a0So I feel like it all worked out the way it was supposed to, and now I don’t have one single vision for our finances, but realize that it’s there for a reason and it’s there to help us in times of need. I don’t feel as stressed about the needing to continue to save at a significant rate. It’s been really helpful to have that money available.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:07:12]\u00a0<\/span><b>Antonio:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Thanks for all your help and advice and support. It definitely gave us that different perspective to put those priorities in place and have that time and space for family and our loved ones.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:07:22]\u00a0<\/span><b>Monica:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0And I will be able to renegotiate my contract. I will be increasing my hours more than likely next year. So I’m in a good place to be able to do that, and I love what I do for work, and hopefully, Antonio will hear back from a few companies soon.<\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">[01:07:42]\u00a0<\/span><b>Antonio:<\/b><span style=\"font-weight: 400;\">\u00a0Thanks, guys. Take care.<\/span><\/p>\n<\/p><\/div>\n\n<p><a href=\"https:\/\/www.iwillteachyoutoberich.com\/241-san-francisco\/\">Source link <\/a><\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Two couples take the stage with a shared question\u2014but very different financial realities: When is \u201cenough\u201d actually enough to move forward? Finn and Luna built […]<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":1,"featured_media":0,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[4557],"tags":[502,5221,6230,6231,6232,4971,6229,4022,6233,6228,5520],"class_list":["post-328756","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","hentry","category-marketing","tag-america","tag-counsel","tag-gerber-life","tag-monica-truthfully","tag-roth","tag-san-francisco","tag-the-charles-schwab","tag-therapist","tag-uc-santa-cruz","tag-web-price","tag-woo"],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.etrafficlane.com\/60dollarmiracle\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/328756","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.etrafficlane.com\/60dollarmiracle\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.etrafficlane.com\/60dollarmiracle\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.etrafficlane.com\/60dollarmiracle\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/1"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.etrafficlane.com\/60dollarmiracle\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=328756"}],"version-history":[{"count":2,"href":"https:\/\/www.etrafficlane.com\/60dollarmiracle\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/328756\/revisions"}],"predecessor-version":[{"id":328758,"href":"https:\/\/www.etrafficlane.com\/60dollarmiracle\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/328756\/revisions\/328758"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.etrafficlane.com\/60dollarmiracle\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=328756"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.etrafficlane.com\/60dollarmiracle\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=328756"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.etrafficlane.com\/60dollarmiracle\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=328756"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}